Eldar Rumour Titbits

[eldargal]

As i said earlier, we the Eldar have gone from king of physic defence to less powerful than a Physic Hood.

I think we've come out better, though, from a psychic power perspective. Being able to shut down enemy psykers was good but it was all quite humdrum. Fortune/Doom/Guide/Runes as far as the eye could see...

[cebalrai]

Vypers haven't changed that much.
They now have BS4.
Still 1-3.
I have my Vypers armed with Scatter Laser/Shuriken Cannon.
Used to cost 70 Points, still does.
If you take it, the Missile Launcher doesn't get Flakk.

Looking at a squad...

Old Vypers with scatter-cannon vs MEQ: 2.9 unsaved wounds
New Vypers with scatter-cannon vs MEQ: 5.3 unsaved wounds


Vypers are almost twice as deadly. I don't know about you but I consider that to be a pretty huge change. And it really gets my goat because people are running around the net writing bad reviews, saying that these things didn't change much when a little bit of simple math says otherwise.

Oh and we can load them up with 5-point bright lances now and make them a serious threat to vehicles of all sizes. For no increase in points or actually fewer points because anti-vehicle kits can forgo the shuriken cannons.

That sounds like kind of a big deal to me.

[Aramel]

Yeah, Scatter Laser-Cannon combo seems like the way to go. Can they get holo-fields? 4+ cover may be worth the extra cost.

[Caitsidhe]

Removed as no longer required.

[Kyban]

Removed as no longer required.

Vypers?

Edit: lol, nevermind.

[Caitsidhe]

Aside from some odd things (mostly already covered) I think the new Codex is certainly playable and will have a couple of competitive builds. Comparing it to my own book, I see that Mr. Kelly clearly has a grip on what he thinks the balance and power levels should be. It is a pity that his vision isn't standardized and that we will be waiting a LONG time before certain other books get equalized.

I think the gentle nudges to try and get people to play larger games and use allies are starting to become more aggressive pushes though.

[Pssyche]

Vypers are almost twice as deadly. I don't know about you but I consider that to be a pretty huge change. And it really gets my goat because people are running around the net writing bad reviews, saying that these things didn't change much when a little bit of simple math says otherwise...

Who gave them a bad review?
Certainly not me.
I told you the significant difference.
They now have BS4.
I'm in work here trying to be helpful during a quick break and you fly off the handle.
I shouldn't have bothered.

[Defenestratus]

Aside from some odd things (mostly already covered) I think the new Codex is certainly playable and will have a couple of competitive builds. Comparing it to my own book, I see that Mr. Kelly clearly has a grip on what he thinks the balance and power levels should be. It is a pity that his vision isn't standardized and that we will be waiting a LONG time before certain other books get equalized.

I think the gentle nudges to try and get people to play larger games and use allies are starting to become more aggressive pushes though.

I agree that the total lack of interceptor in the army (for a race that can see the future, you'd think that it would pop up here and there) is a pretty blatant message that allies are the way of the future.

Which on a personal note is disappointing.

[Idaho11]

Who gave them a bad review?
Certainly not me.
I told you the significant difference.
They now have BS4.
I'm in work here trying to be helpful during a quick break and you fly off the handle.
I shouldn't have bothered.

I thought he was quoting you just to have the numbers in his post. Others have been giving them a thumbs down, but I don't think he was trying to imply that you were one of them. He just used your post as a jumping-off point so that people could check his math.

[Caitsidhe]

Which on a personal note is disappointing.

I feel the same way but I'm not suprised. Depending on your point of view I'm either a pragmatist or a cynic (or both). I thought from the very start that Games Workshop was clealry trying to accomplish two goals:

1. Increase the model count on the table which in turn should lead to more sales.
2. Push allies to move people toward owning 2+ armies rather than one. *Also equates to more sales.

The laws of unintended consequences took its toll thouigh, because their rules set wasn't very good. The clunky mechanics and ham-handed way they attempted to manipulate things simply caused the standard sized game to SHRINK. I suspect had the rules been better, they might have achieved #1, but larger games are so tedious and slow (for the most part) that even those willing to pay more rather (as a general rule) play smaller games. In regards to the second goal they weren't that successful either. The only people embracing allies in a reliable way were the hardcore tournament players looking to wring every drop of advantage out. It hasn't really taken off, even with the more competitive set.

The long and the short of it is that people aren't stupid. Even the most forgiving apologist for Games Workshop knows what's going on and somewhat resents the manipulation. I do happen to think that they will, over time, manage to accomplish #2. When it didn't happen on its own they have been ramping up the pressure by making it more and more clear that without allies you are skunked. The people that continue to play and care about being competitive will capitulate. Long term, I don't think Games Workshop is engaging in a good strategy for their own fiscal health. I could go into why, but such discussions and arguments are for another thread. It suffices to say that Eldar are in EXACTLY the same position against fliers that they were in with the previous book. They must rely on volume of twin-linked fire, War Walkers, and their air-to-air killing kite.