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  1. #1

    Question new to warhammer fantasy it intrests me

    Ok I have my BRB for warhammer fantasy and my daemon army book I read have briefly read them both (because most of it I don't understand) and they feel really different to warhammer 40k like there's a hole new phase and the army needs banners instrument also the banners can have special bonuses applied to them I feel at the moment slightly overwhelmed so can someone give me some insight on things I should do when planning a army from what I hear someone said start with a lord and work around him also plan accordingly to what benefits the units with the rules for example if I was going any of the 3 lore's of magic in the daemon book take the troops that correspond with them to benefit from free models.

    Things I wish to know.

    The % in army listing in order of unit type what should I think of after my lord I intend to get a daemon prince due to I can a just him for low or high point games

    How should I deal with point allotments like for example when does a unit become too expensive?

    What does BSB mean and how many can I take judging by the big rule book i am assuming its 1?

    Troops in the daemon army can take magical banners from the brb are there any restrictions like can I take the same one two times?

    I could be missing out some stuff so please provide any tips or advice for future reference if it would provide some aid.

  2. #2

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    Not sure if this stacks but bloodletters come with magic resistance (1) if i give them a lichbone pennant would they get magic resistance (2)?

  3. #3
    Battle-Brother
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    Welcome to fantasy! I'll answer as many of your questions as possible.

    For Daemons a Daemon prince is a good place to start, it is fairly cheap as hq's go and you can upgrade it several ways depending on what you want to do with him. He can be a great fighter, Wizard or a combination of the two.

    One way or the other you really want to have a good magic user in your army. You will find in fantasy that the magic phase can make or break you. The daemon price can be used as a "wizard" or you can grab any one of the heralds (except Khorne).

    There is no right way to decided when a unit becomes to expensive in WH. When building a unit I try to find a balance between numbers and abilities. It can be hard to do but with some practice you can find good balances.

    BSB, Battle Standard Bearer, Allows most armies to reroll leadership checks. I may be mistaken but I don't believe daemonds have the ability to take one. Daemons have a few army wide special rules when it come to that kind of thing.

    You may only take one of each magical banners in the main rule book.
    Off with there heads!!!!!

  4. #4

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    BSB page 89 daemon army book (box at the bottom of the page) a herald can choose to take daemonic gifts or trade that out for a magical standard with no point limit.

  5. #5
    Battle-Brother
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    Ah, good call! That means you can re-roll the demonic instability rolls. Very useful.
    Off with there heads!!!!!

  6. #6

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    Guess ill take a herald of tzeentch with the BSB? due to he is a wizard and i plan to have horrors also because they are wizards

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xaric View Post
    Not sure if this stacks but bloodletters come with magic resistance (1) if i give them a lichbone pennant would they get magic resistance (2)?
    Unfortunately, no. Only the highest level of magic resistance is in effect. If you have two MR(1) items, you still only have MR(1). That being said, MR works with existing ward saves. So a daemon with MR(1) gets a 4+ Ward save versus magic.

    As for your other questions I'll offer some input in addition to Theblackprince.

    (1) Daemon Prince is great for higher points levels, but honestly I'd rather just go with a greater damon at that point. For lower level games take several heralds that match your unit matchups (so nurgle herald if you have nurgle units, etc).

    (2) Well, the first indication is if you burst the point allocation for that section of the army. So a 300 point rare unit in a 1000 point army won't work as rare's are limited to 250 points in 1000 points. Otherwise the best way to check the effectiveness of a unit is to put it on the tabletop. Otherwise it varies by army. For Skaven a unit will lose effectiveness at a much lower point threshold than say, a Daemon of Warriors of Chaos army whose units cost substantially more.

    (3) As TBP pointed out the BSB is the Battle Standard Bearer that allows you to reroll leadership checks for units within 12". The key here is "all leadership checks". Daemons won't have too many leadership issues outside of combat but other armies can reroll failed reform checks, failed march checks, failed psychology tests (Fear, terror, panic, etc). It's important to remember as if your army relies on leadership checks or forcing leadership checks then BSBs are invaluable.

    (4) Same restrictions as any other army. See pages 302 to 303 as well as the restrictions stated above each magic item type (so 304 for weapons, 306 for armor, 308 for banners, etc). Typically, unless an item says it can be taken multiple times, magic items (all of them, including banners) are unique.

    Suggestions for daemons? Make sure your unit sizes work for the points level. I see too many people using small units of 10 or so in 2000+ points and they just don't work.
    Armies - Skaven, Tomb Kings, Eldar, Iron Snakes, Dark Eldar, Retribution, & Legion
    Blog - http://chronowraith.blogspot.com

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xaric View Post
    ...The % in army listing in order of unit type what should I think of after my lord I intend to get a daemon prince due to I can a just him for low or high point games...
    I would suggest you to have a second thought on the daemon prince as you are new to fantasy.
    With a Leadership of 9 & so many points it takes, it would probably be your general.
    A general can offer your nearby units benefit on Ld test, and extra victory points would be given to your oppenent if your general is killed.
    A daemon prince usually has 4+ armour only (unless you give it a greater gift & you're so lucky to roll a 5), and it is a monster, which means it can never be saved by the "look out sir" rule.
    Also its Toughness & Wound are both relatively low.
    All these tells us that it'd be a risk to lose your general easily, so a daemon prince does not seem to be a good choice of general for a new player.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xaric View Post
    ...How should I deal with point allotments like for example when does a unit become too expensive?...
    There is no standard answer for this as everyone may play in different styles & tactics, but here are some points you may like to think about.
    1. Can you expect this unit to get you the points equal to or even more than its own cost ??
    2. Can your army still work fairly if this unit is somehow "trapped", redirected or even destroyed ??
    3. Does the unit or other unit of your army have a solution when the situation in (2.) occurs ??
    4. Do you have to sacrifice the efficiency of your other units for the cost of this unit ?? If so would that change the structure of your army ??
    Of course there much much more you may have to think about, I just hope the above ones may give you some inspirations or directions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xaric View Post
    ...What does BSB mean and how many can I take judging by the big rule book i am assuming its 1?...
    BSB = Battle Standard Bearer
    In most armies this guy allows units nearby to re-roll failed Ld test. In a Daemon Army it also allows you to re-roll Daemonic Instability test, which could be critical (you may want to go for the gaming changing double 1s, or you may simply want to avoid that double 6s !!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Xaric View Post
    ...Troops in the daemon army can take magical banners from the brb are there any restrictions like can I take the same one two times?...
    BRB already mentions that a magic item (including banner) can only be taken once per army.
    Other than that you choose the banners within the cost limit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xaric View Post
    ...I could be missing out some stuff so please provide any tips or advice for future reference if it would provide some aid...
    There're things easy to forget, such as loci cover each others, and Inspiring presence / Hold your ground only benefits the units under the same god with the general / BSB.
    Also you may have to seek agreement with your opponent befor the game starts, as the army book or errata does not clearly state, that if an unit can re-roll for Daemonic Instability test while the BSB is under another god.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xaric View Post
    Not sure if this stacks but bloodletters come with magic resistance (1) if i give them a lichbone pennant would they get magic resistance (2)?
    No, the banner only give magic resistance (1) to the unit.
    BRB states that when a unit have more than 1 set of MR, they don't combine, and you simply choose the highest one to use.

  9. #9

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    Ok at the moment I have my army planed for a 2000 point army as the people at my local GW said that's what most people normally play so far the units I have in mind are.

    Daemon prince with a wizard level (depends on the points I wish to pool into him) with chaos armor.
    Herald of Tzeentch and the locus of conjuration with BSB.
    Pink horrors with the musician, iridescent horror and standard bearer (correct me if I am doing any mistakes here).
    Bloodletters for my hammer unit with musician Bloodreaper and standard bearer with banner of swiftness.
    Seekers of slaanesh as my flanking units with musician heartseaker and standard bearer with banner of eternal flame.
    Plaguedrones as my anvil unit not sure what to give them yet but I plan to get atleast 7.

    ok it said when pink horrors miscast the unit takes the hits does that account the herald if he is part of the unit i am assuming it does but to be sure I will ask the forum. also can i choose to roll say 1 dice when casting a spell?

    Models like seekers should I glue the daemonetts to the seekers? And the same for the plaguedrones?.

    Death heads or venom sting? Or split them into 2 squads have the velom stingers with the banner plaguebringer and standard and have the other squad with death heads?.

    Is it a good idea to have the BSB with a standard bearer in the same unit?.

    I pick the models mostly because I love the looks of them some of the really strong units that people advice I don't like due to the look of them so have no intent of buying them I play to have fun not to power game.

    I did some research on points and a naked lord of change vs. a daemon prince of tzeentch with wings and mastery lv 2 the daemon prince is 30 points cheaper give him chaos armor and he's only 10 points cheaper but the lord of change has 1+ T, BS and W I guess that's where you pay for the points.
    Last edited by Xaric; 02-17-2014 at 08:24 AM.

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