Why I think 7th is the worst yet; and what it forgot (a negative view of 7th ed 40k)

[Lost Vyper]

Yep, World of Pain and i represent the Reseda Prime -FLGC and the last missions we have played, have been the best in months! As for the 7th edition, i personally like the Maelstrom, but as an Eldar player, i have a HUGE advantage...speed. I also like the Psychic phase better now, cos it´s not auto success --> creates more possibilities during the match. BUT, i concur, that the copy/paste + FORGETTING stuff is a huge disappointment in this edition...

So, back to the matches we have played.

PRIMARY : We have had objectives (3-5) who holds the most gets 3 VP
SECONDARY : Kill points, or fixed Maelstrom deck, ten cards 2VP for the winner
TERTIARY : First Blood, Slay the Warlord, Line Breaker, Last Laugh a point each

for the next match, i was thinking about KP´s as Primary and Maelstrom as Secondary...

[Reldane]

I must say I quite like having Maelstrom missions, it forces me to think in different ways to how I did and to think more about movement instead of playing a gunline. It also, in my opinion, encourages the players to look at objectives before turn 5 which I feel has always been a flaw with objectives.

I like the psychic phase; it toned down at least some of the over the top nature of 6th edd psychicness, even if it added some more problems I feel that on the whole it made the game more enjoyable. That being said I have played a lot of Warhammer Fantasy and the new psychic phase isn't dissimilar to the magic phase.

I think the current books are better balanced than I have seen in my 10 years playing, of course there are better armies, but there are certainly not many outright bad armies. In the end though it comes down to personal preference, my advice would be to find some friends who are like minded and play with them (with what ever house rules you feel will make things more enjoyable). If you are playing in a tournament then you need to accept whatever the rules are and move on; complaining in about competitive rules set (regardless of quality) merely comes across as whinging and making excuses. Doing so is no better than the actions of various sporting personalities who in post sports match interviews would blame referee for their loss.

[Wolfshade]

To be fair when most people are comparing editions they accept that RT and 2nd are very different beasts to 3,4,5,6,7

That's because 2nd with Dark Millenium was the bestest ever.

Virus Bomb, Chain Lightning + Ultimate Force ftw! (or ftepicloss)

[World Of Pain]

Reldane. You gave some nice personal opinion but I think you missed the point. You say to follow the rules in tournaments but I have allready pointed out that many of the rules don't work at all or are copletely missing from this edition. Also it takes a lot of time to come up all the missing rules with you oponents because now almost everyone has some different house rules to overcome problems caused by the missing rules in BRB.

[Reldane]

Reldane. You gave some nice personal opinion but I think you missed the point.

thank you and you are quite possibly correct, it was rather late when I was typing. I think my point with regards to tournaments is that by going you are accepting their rules, whatever they might be and your aim is to build and play as best as you can to those rules. complaining about those rules more oft than not comes across as moans and whines for example: I play [assault themed army] I hate 7th edd because shooting is so strong, how am I meant to get into combat. it may be true, but it sounds to other people like you are trying to make excuses and you want your army to be an auto win for you.

house rules needn't be complicated so long as they are made to not favour one army over another.

[confoo22]

The funny thing is that I kind of feel like World of Pain and Lost Vyper are pointing out part of what actually makes this edition good. They saw the Maelstrom mission wasn't working for them, made slight modifications but left the basic system intact, and are now enjoying the missions immensely by their own admission. 7th ed is all about giving you the tools, GW's suggested framework, and then letting you make the game what you want it to be. I understand that players want this stuff given to them in an official package so that they don't have to have a discussion concerning it, but honestly I find the creative process of tinkering with the rules and creating new missions to be part of the fun of the hobby. Of course, that's just my opinion.

I'm also unclear as to what exactly the gripe here is: Is 7th edition the worst yet, as the title suggests, or does it simply fail to live up to the OP's expectations? I get that the rules are not absolutely tight and that they tend to sprawl, but most of the complaints I'm seeing are opinion based. That's fine in and of itself, but if this is just another "Let's talk about the rules we all hate" thread then it's not really a "Why this edition is the worst" thread.

[Charistoph]

I'm also unclear as to what exactly the gripe here is: Is 7th edition the worst yet, as the title suggests, or does it simply fail to live up to the OP's expectations? I get that the rules are not absolutely tight and that they tend to sprawl, but most of the complaints I'm seeing are opinion based. That's fine in and of itself, but if this is just another "Let's talk about the rules we all hate" thread then it's not really a "Why this edition is the worst" thread.

It's true, many people are putting it that way.

My complaint was very simple and had nothing to do with specific rules (though I gave one as an example), but this edition is definitely the loosest group of rules so far. And not like the good "footloose" style, I'm talking about the loose that sends your sail off in to the sea when a mildly strong wind hits it.

A lot of the rules that were affected by some of the major changes seemed to have been completely ignored as to the consequences and their interactions with each other. Especially when some things could have been copied and pasted over with no difficulties, but they still choose not to do so (for example, the order for setting up a game).

However, in terms of over all completeness for flexibility, it is one of the best editions ever.

[40kGamer]

While I like the goal of not restricting players with a burdensome rules framework I have to agree that some of the actual rules interactions are terrible... and most are painfully obvious. It feels like GW has pulled funding from the rules design team to where this is the staff they can afford...

[World Of Pain]

confoo22 and 40KGamer; really nice points there (love that picture). But I don´t think that GW planed to release this edition so poorly written. They just didnt test play it enough or did so with wrong people. Our club allready has about two A4 pages full of house rules - just to fix those major problems that 7th edition causes. Its hard for me to understand how people who dont have the luxury of playing with the same people everytime can overcome these problems without spending first at least 30 minutes to house rule things.

Once again my three main points for this headline are:

1) 7th edition is missing way too many BASIC rules that players should not have to invent them self.
2) 7th edition has many rules that do not work at all if played as RAW and people should not have to fix these basic rules by them self.
3) 7th editon had the BEST resource and information to become a really good edition but it failed to do so and still was the most expensive one.

[silashand]

some of the actual rules interactions are terrible... and most are painfully obvious.

This. Stupid ideas like vehicles not being able to overwatch are also problems I have with the rules. While I get maybe battle cannons should not, the whole reason every nation that can puts machine guns on them (and has since the beginnings of armoured warfare) is to repel attackers. And that's only one example. It's stupidity like this that makes me believe the proverbial monkeys on typewriters is what GW provides us. Eventually they may produce Shakespeare, but until then it's just garbage.

even when balanced the game is still a glorified "chase the shiny"

I like using maelstrom to generate random hidden secondary missions (as opposed to first blood, warlord and linebreaker) but its a terrible primary game

Agree completely.