Are the Eldar actually good guys?

[YorkNecromancer]

I've noticed a few people on BoLS who regard the idea of the good Eldar allying with the evil Dark Eldar to be utterly beyond the pale.

Why would the good Eldar work with their evil, evil cousins? That would never happen in real life. I mean, the idea that the Eldar and Dark Eldar could ally is as ridiculous as the CIA sponsoring the Taleban…

Oh, wait.

That happened, didn't it? Okay, poor example. But it's as ridiculous as heroically democratic Americans and the evil brainwashed communist Soviets fighting alongside one another against…

Oh wait. WW2.

Yes, I'm being a little facetious, but the point that mutually hostile forces unite for a variety of complex political reasons is a good one, because in real-life, it happens all the time. This is before we even get down to the idea that allies are those who are at least somewhat like us... And what other species out there is really like the Eldar? The humans don't come close, the idea of similarities with the Orks is a joke, and as for those little blue bullet-proof shiel… sorry, and as for the Tau? Well, they're just so sweet, but children remain children and royalty remains royalty. Maybe the Necrons, but the idea of existing as a soulless reanimated metal revenant is probably the worst thing an Eldar can imagine. You know, Wraithbone's okay, but not metal.

No-one's like the Eldar but the Eldar, and the idea the two factions of their ancient species wouldn't work together is something about the community that always surprises me. It might be because I remember 1st edition, where every species/faction was unremittingly evil, but I always assumed that the Eldar were (and are) one of the most unpleasant species out there, 'Dark' or not. They certainly were when I was growing up: a highly intelligent, scientifically advanced species, with powers of precognition and foresight, who use that power exclusively for their own survival, content to burn away billions of other sentient beings if it means they get Just One More Day... See, that doesn't sound like good guys to me. Yes, the Eldar don't have the Power From Pain rules their 'Dark' cousins do to codify their malevolence, but they are a species who practise the ritual sacrifice of their own: that Avatar has to come from somewhere. And as for the necromantic practises that lead to the Wraith constructs; murdering a twin, leaving their sibling wracked with grief and forced to spend their life psychically linked to their dead memory... all so your Wraithknight has a pilot? Is your species not advanced enough to find any other way to pilot a giant mech?

The Eldar are pretty dark. Maybe not, "BWAHAHAHAHAHAA I'M SOOOOO EVILLLL…" like the cartoonish villainy of the Dark Eldar, but actually dark – the kind of people who can set aside ethics in the name of necessity, no matter what.

Now, I'm sure there will be a solid discussion about this below, so there are some assumptions about the Eldar 'being good' that should to be considered as well.

1.) The Eldar race is worthy of survival.
Well, what does 'worthy' mean? Yeah, every sentient being is worthy of survival, but we've established: the Eldar are prejudiced against every other race. They're the KKK with pointy ears, happy to let any other sentient species die if it means they live. Understandable? Definitely. Darwinian? Sure. Morally right?
I did what I had to do.
It was for the greater good.
These deaths/crimes are justified by greater need.
Know who says things like that a lot?
The bad guy in everything ever. These are villain words. Someone who talks about 'greater good' implies there is a 'lesser evil', and that this 'lesser' evil must be tolerated, because Reasons.

2.) The Eldar race's ancient knowledge cannot afford to be lost.
Why not?
It's not like they care about anyone else's ancient knowledge; the Necrons are older and have easily as advanced technology – if we lost the Eldar, there'd be plenty of knowledge left out there. Does simply being good at something justify your existence? Does it allow you to kill those without said knowledge if it helps you survive?
Not in a whole, law-of-the-jungle way: in an 'I'm the good guy and I want to help save lives' way.

3.) The Eldar are clearly good guys because they're attractive.
There's a reason the heroes are usually attractive and the villains deformed. There's a reason if you've got facial deformities or scars people will mock or attack you. We're simple creatures as a species, and we tend to trust beauty and distrust ugliness. Eldar have elegance and aesthetics on their side; they don't look as horrid as the other species in 40K, and they're not as overtly fascist as the Imperium, so they must be the good guys, right?

4.) They don't do it deliberately; it's the nature of the 40K universe that forces their hand.
Is that enough? To premeditatedly force the other species and factions into galaxy-spanning wars of conquest, force-evolving the Tau to their current technological high-point to act as a buffer against the horrors out there, forcing them to die instead of precious, precious Eldar?

5.) They're not called Dark Eldar.
True. But just because your brother's the one who's a serial killer, does that mean your crimes get a free pass?

Ultimately, the Eldar creed boils down to 'necessity justifies that which is right'. They're just doing what they have to. They have to survive, because it is the duty of all life to survive.

Is this enough for us to call them 'good guys'? Not 'by comparison'. Actual, honest-to-Throne good guys.

Are they actually that different to the Dark Eldar? Oh, sure, they don't torture needlessly (because including the qualifier 'needlessly' makes it okay?) like their Dark iterations, but they do kill. A lot. Of innocents. For themselves.

Would Spiderman choose to push a planet of a hundred billion souls into the path of a Hive Fleet if it meant he got to spend another day with Mary-Jane? Would we call him a hero if he did? How about Batman? At his darkest, at his absolute worst, would he do that? Would the Doctor, or Superman? Would they sacrifice a planet of innocents if it meant they got their respective homeworlds back? Could they look at themselves in the mirror afterwards if they did?

So, simple enough really:

Are the Eldar the good guys? Not compared to the other species. Compared to whatever standard of morality as you choose to define it, whether that be true pacifist selflessness, or brute, self-serving, Darwinian mechanics.

[Mr Mystery]

Eldar are essentially entirely self interested gits.

Seriously, consider what is actually more evil? A slave raid by Dark Eldar, or Craftworld Eldar mucking about with fate to ensure the rise of Ghazghkull? You know, the Ork that has rampaged around the Imperium.

Both are/were done to ensure Eldar survival. Frankly, I find Dark Eldar the lesser of the two evils, simply because their actions are honest.

[YorkNecromancer]

Totally agree. They're monsters, but they don't pretend to be anything else. You know where you stand with a Dark Eldar - behind the barrel of the most dakka you can find, saving the last round for yourself.

[Mr Mystery]

Plus, you know that Dark Eldar offering to help will definitely betray you.

Craftworld Eldar? They're up to something. Every time. No such thing as altruism. They're arrogant in the extreme, and to me even more so than Dark Eldar.

Consider the Black Library. Good Lord the good that could be done with that. But what they do? Sit on it. Hoard it. None others can possibly be trusted with it. After all, they're The Eldar. They know best. It's not like they birthed a Chaos God from their own hubris. Oh. Wait.

Douchebags I tells ya!

[YorkNecromancer]

To be fair, I'm sure those harlequins know just what they're doing.

I'd trust a man in a grinning metal mask whose official title is 'Death Jester' any day of the week.

I mean, not that I'd have a choice about trusting him or not...

[Cap'nSmurfs]

You've hit the nail on the head, YorkN.

[Harley]

Good post. It should be obvious to students of history, as you have suggested, that the Eldar are pragmatists and in the darkness of the distant future there are no good guys. In fact, in any war there are no good guys, today, yesterday and tomorrow. The Allied troops may have liberated Europe but they bombed a lot of towns and killed a lot of civilians doing it, which doesn't even begin to cover the Pacific theatre. War can be unavoidable, seem necessary, and facilitate great changes... but it is never "good".

[Mr Mystery]

Indeed. Ever found it odd how the good guys always win? Which is a crude way of pointing out history is written by the victors, 100% of the time.

But with Craftworld Eldar? There's always a high price. It may not manifest in the lifetimes of anyone who will remember their intervention. Heck, it might happen in a completely different sector. But it's there. And it's not the Eldar paying it, not if they can possibly avoid it.

As for the various Kins of Eldar fighting together? I covered that in a different thread, pointing out my general loathing for my cousin. But as much as I can't stand the twonk, he remains family, and thus I would help him if he needed it. We're diametrically opposed otherwise, but family is family, blood is blood, and you stand together when the chips are down. Sorry, I know that went a bit Eastenders, but it's true.

Imagine if you will that for seemingly no reason, Craftworld, Dark, Corsair and Exodite band together for an attack somewhere. Who knows the motivations? Easy. Farseer has scried the futures, and identified a threat to one, other or all which can be easily averted just by acting together now. In return for support of the Dark Kin, it's agreed any and all survivors of the enemy are there's to do with as they wish. Blind eye is turned, because it's preferable that lower beings suffer horrendously than Farseer Bob actually spills that really nice glass of wine in 500 years time, especially because that glass of really nice wine will leave a horrible stain on the carpet that he uses for scrying.

[YorkNecromancer]

'Me against my brother; my brother and I against our father; my father and I against my uncle; my uncle and I against the stranger.'

[Mr Mystery]

Yuparoo.

And that to me is the endearing thing about 40k. Nobody is on anyone's side. Quite often, not even their own. Without going rogue, Chapters of Marines will fight amongst themselves, usually over honour. Chaos? Like Skaven in Warhammer, if they could just stop infighting and undermining each other, they'd have flattened the Imperium millenia ago. Orks? Only stop fighting each other when there's someone else to beat up, and even then it still happens. Eldar? Craftworlds all seem to think they and they alone know best. Imperial Guard? Who knows! Inquisition? Different factions, different ethos within the factions. Even Tyranids will devour each other, though arguably for the best of reasons (actually aids their constant evolution!). Tau? Not much so far, at least not that they're letting on. But Farsight? Likely just the tip of the iceberg.

No other game system that I'm aware of has such blurred lines within it. And I love it. All of it. It adds narrative depth like nobodies business.

Classic example? Imperium fights as a single entity on a given planet, against a Chaos Incursion. Fleet, IG, Marines, Sisters, Inquisition, Knight, everyone. Imperium triumphs. Inquisition promptly slaughter the Guard, or at best send them off to a penal world, Space Marines get mind wiped (even Blood Angels, the one progenitor Chapter we know to have resisted the call of Khorne!), Sisters? I think they get killed off as well. Knights? Possibly mind wiped, as akin to Marines, they're too rare a resource just to slot because gribblies.