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  1. #11

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    It depends on what you need. Generally in such an elite army I'd welcome the chance to include some cheap and disposable units like Predators, Speeders, Wolves, and Dreads. Adding more point sinks to an army of point sinks doesn't seem that worthwhile to be honest.

    A couple units of WG dropping in would be useful, especially if you have mobile support to back them up.

  2. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivarr View Post
    I was actually thinking of doing a foot slogging Wolf Guard termie army also....something like:

    Logan Grimnar: 275

    10 Wolf Guard Terminators (6 w/wolf claw + storm bolter, 2 w/heavy flamer + chainfist, 2 w/storm bolter + power weapon) 400

    10 Wolf Guard Terminators (8 w/wolf claw + storm bolter, 1 w/heavy flamer + powerfist, 1 w/assault cannon + power fist) 425

    10 Wolf Guard Terminators (1 w/thunder hammer + storm bolter, 4 w/wolf claw + storm bolter, 2 w/assault cannon + power fist, 3 w/storm bolter + power weapon) 445

    10 Wolf Guard Terminators (1 w/wolf claw + thunder hammer, 7 w/wolf claw + storm bolter, 1w/ assault cannon + power fist, 1w/ assault cannon + power weapon) 455

    Total 2000 points

    I really love the idea of Wolf Guard terminators with 1 wolf claw and a storm bolter...just seems more "Space Wolfie" than TH/SB or PW/SB. In any case what do you folks think?
    Am I missing something but how come no force org troops?
    I'M RATHER DEFINATELY SURE FEMALE SPACE MARINES DEFINERTLEY DON'T EXIST.

  3. #13

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    Logan Grimnar let's Wolf Guard units count as Troops..

    Chris

  4. #14

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    My idea would be the following:

    basically an iron rain with termies.

    Logan Grimnar (attached to squat1)

    Dreadnought (heavy bolter, plasmacannon, wolftail charm) in droppod

    Squat1 (5 termies): 3 combi-meltas (1 powerweapon, 1 frostaxe, 1 chainfist), 1 stormbolter/powerweapon, 1 cyclone and dual wolfclaws ( goes to squat 2 to make room for logan) in droppod

    Squat2 (5 grey hunters) in droppod

    Sqaut3-5 (5termies) 2 kombimeltas /w frostblade, 2 stormshields /w powerweapon, 1 chainfist with assoult cannon in droppod


    logan, the all-termie squads as well as the dreadnought are planned to go up and personal (hopeing to kill at least half the enemies heavy tanks in initial drop'n'melta action) while the grey unter squad with the cycle stays back and babysits my objective.
    with 21 terminators and a dreadnought I think I'm not that badly outnumbered (especially since I'm usually going to dig into heavy melee turn2) as other termie lists who rely on expensive landraiders.

    the assoult cannons should help me deal with the remaining tanks (they are still amazing. even more if logan switches squads mdigame and makes one of them tank hunter!) as well as all sorts of infantry.

  5. #15

    Default Competitive Logan-Wing 2k

    As a long time Space Wolf player using the Deathwing rules and Tactica; this army has been a long time in coming!

    I wanted to see how hard I could make a foot slogging terminator army. I think the SW codex makes it possible to compete against many of the tourney builds out there

    A solid core of footslogging terminators, advancing in a phalanx. This is a list where Logan is worth every point, all but guranteeing counter attack, and juicing up his 10x man bodyguard with Tank hunters, Preferred Enemy and Stubborn once they start to lose their numbers...

    The rest of the army is carefully selected units that plug the gaps and weaknesses inherent in a all-terminator list.

    Landspeeders pop Landraiders, or hide out to turbo boost and contest pbjectives that cant be readily contested by the foot sloggers.

    Razorbacks provide long range AP2 and anti-tank punch, shielding terminators from plasma blasts, demolisher rounds and Lash of Submission.

    All heavy weapons designed to waste the opponents transports and mobility early on to retake the initiative.

    If I can force them to footslog, I have the advantage.

    Against static gunline, deploy in refused flank, all units can move and fire at full capacity. Use cover and RB's to block LOS to diagonal fire and overwhelm one flank of the enemy line while the other has little/ no targets.


    full battle reports and army thread here:

    http://www.warseer.com/forums/showth...83#post4005683


    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    HQ: 385


    Logan Grimnar 275

    [SW version of Marneus Calgar]
    close combat monster, army wide enhancer
    [SW version of Marneus Calgar]
    WS 6 BS5 I5 3W, 5A Ld10
    Eternal Warrior
    Wolf Tail Talisman
    Wolf Tooth Necklace
    Belt of Russ
    Saga of Majesty (Ld Reroll to all units within 6")
    Living Legend (once per game, all friendlies get +1 Attack in assault within 18")
    The High King (can grant either: Fearless, Relentless, Tank Hunters, or Preferred Enemy to an attached squad)
    Axe of Morkia (reforged Daemon weapon! allocated attacks as a mix of str5 power weapon or str 8 power fist)
    Storm Bolter
    WolfGuard as Troops


    Rune Priest 110
    Chooser of the Slain
    Living Lightning
    Murderous Hurricane

    TROOPS: 1300

    Wolf Guard Pack Alpha [x 5] 215
    Terminator Armour,
    4x Storm Bolters /3x Power Weapons
    +1 Wolf Claw
    +1 Chain Fist
    +1 Assault Cannon

    ________
    Razorback with Lascannon and Twin Linked Plasma Guns 75
    Dedicated Transport:
    ________


    Wolf Guard Pack Bravo [x 5] 210
    Terminator Armour,
    4x Storm Bolters / 4x Power Weapons
    +1 Chainfist
    +1 Assault Cannon




    Wolf Guard Pack Charlie [x 5] 210
    Terminator Armour,
    5x Storm Bolters / 4x Power Weapons
    +1 Chainfist
    +1 Cyclone Rocket Launcher
    ________
    Razorback with Twin Linked Lascannons 75
    Dedicated Transport:
    ________



    Wolf Guard Pack Delta [x 10] 440
    Terminator Armour,
    8x Storm Bolters / 6x Power Weapons
    +1 Wolf Claw
    +1 Storm Shield
    +2 Chain Fist
    +2 Cyclone Rocket Launchers
    ________
    Razorback with Twin Linked Lascannons 75
    Dedicated Transport:
    ________


    FAST ATTACK: 190

    Landspeeder 60
    Multi Melta

    Landspeeder 60
    Multi Melta

    Landspeeder 70
    Multi Melta /Hvy Flamer


    ELITES: 125

    “Carlos the Jackal” 125
    Mortis Pattern Dreadnought
    2x Twin-Linked Autocannons
    ----------------------------------------

    Anti-Tank/Transport:

    3x Multi-Melta (Fast Vehicle)
    2x Twin Linked Lascannon (Light Tanks)
    1x Lascannon (Light Tank)
    4x Str 9 Krak Missiles (Tank Hunting, Relentless)
    2x Str 8 Krak Missiles (Relentless)
    2x Twin-Linked Autocannons (Dreadnought)
    1x Living Lightning (D6x Autocannon, U/L Range)
    1x Twin Linked Plasmagun (Light Tank)
    2x Assault Cannons (Relentless)

    5x Chainfists (Assault AT)
    1x Logan Grimnar (5/6x Power Fist attacks with Tank Hunter against vehicles, or attacks with Preferred Enemy against MC's, Dreads, and Defilers)

    Anti-Horde:

    23x Storm Bolters
    1x Heavy Flamer (Fast Vehicle)
    6x Frag Missiles (Relentless)
    1x Living Lightning/Murderous Hurricane
    2x Twin Linked Autocannons (Dreadnought)
    2x Assault Cannons (Relentless)

    25x Terminators with 3/4x attacks, all power weapon or better (10x w/ Preferred Enemy)
    1x Logan Grimnar (Storm Bolter, Preferred Enemy, 5/6x Frost Axe attacks)
    Last edited by Sons of Russ; 10-04-2009 at 12:16 AM.

  6. #16

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Chumbalaya View Post
    It depends on what you need. Generally in such an elite army I'd welcome the chance to include some cheap and disposable units like Predators, Speeders, Wolves, and Dreads. Adding more point sinks to an army of point sinks doesn't seem that worthwhile to be honest..
    Point!

    That being said, I suspect its more a difference of philosophy – what do you expect to see across the table from you?


    1) The way I see it, having cheap, disposable units is only really an issue if/when VP are a factor – the trouble with cheap, disposable units is that, well, they’re relatively easy to dispose of.


    2) Current trends definitely lean towards heavily-mechanised armies with lots of relatively cheap medium/light vehicles.

    As such, I’d expect my opponent to plan accordingly – I’d expect him to have some means of dealing with multiple Chimeras/Rhinos/Trukks/skimmer transports in his army list. Assault cannon, autocannon in various configurations, deffguns and the like.

    Guess what’s going to zero in on all those light/medium Predator, Speeders and Dreads?

    Once you bring AV14 into play, however, all those S6/S7/S8 guns are going to patter off your heavy armour (or Terminator suits) like a gentle spring rain – it doesn’t help that the most effective guns for killing AV14 are ALSO the guns that you’d want to use on Terminators.

    In the meantime, you’d also have enough foot-sloggers (10 Terminators take up a LOT of space, especially at maximum separation) to keep the other guy’s pesky melta-weapons at arm’s length.


    I’d agree, however, that the single biggest argument against taking a few big point sinks (3+ terminator units, 1-2 Land Raiders) as opposed to spreading out your firepower would be the popularity of Tau/Eldar/Dark Eldar armies (armies that scoff at AV14) in your neck of the woods.

  7. #17

    Default

    it doesn’t help that the most effective guns for killing AV14 are ALSO the guns that you’d want to use on Terminators.
    While this is true, anti-infantry and massed low strength guns can also do a number on terminators. I also play Deathwing, and on a point-by-point basis, I'm more afraid of massed FRFSRF guardsmen than most anti-tank shooting platforms.

  8. #18

    Default

    Oh absolutely – my Terminators are terrified of low-strength/high-volume wounding hits (shooting OR close-combat).

    I’m usually more worried about Ork shootas than Guard lasrifles, though.


    However, the kicker here is range.

    By the time lasrifles really come into play, well, the game is pretty much over...(well, ok, more like turn 4 , but definitely mid/late game.)


    For the first couple of turns, however, the only fire I’m going to be receiving would be from anti-tank weapons in the 36”-48” envelope (the exception being troops deploying out of drop pods). At that range, I’d expect to see a lot more autocannon, multilasers, deffguns and missile launchers than lascannon.


    And seeing as how the odds of actually inflicting significant damage on Terminators or Land Raiders with low-volume/high-AP weapons are fairly, well, low, what else should I shoot at?

  9. #19

    Default

    Maybe I can help by pointing out what I would take to counter your wolf guard armies.

    as an IG player, i would bring (to a competitive game not a friendly)

    vanquisher, for the few landraiders, executioners to place 3 plasma blasts down on slow footslogging termys, and medusas to blast ordinance holes in termys.

    masses of infantry would fill in the points and FO chart, possibly backed up with a lascannon squad for anti-tank help.

    when it comes to MEQ of anykind, I always load up on the AP1 and 2 weapons.


    so my question to you is, if I were to take this, how would you modify your force to counter it? its a combo of battle tanks (so you need some good Anti armour) and horde infantry so you need to get your termys into assault early on in thegame to start clawing through the numbers.

    (I have a small space wolves army and am actually very interested in your thread, I havent seen the new codex yet though, might have to invest soon)
    Conscription in the Lucky 88th
    http://lucky88th.blogspot.com


  10. #20

    Default

    Its gonna be a bit of a slog, true.

    That being said:

    1) A squad or three of podding Terminators would be helpful - they’re there to:
    a) Attempt an early kill on the key tanks.
    MAYBE add a cyclone to the squad in case of a bad (backwards) scatter and/or really dense infantry screens to keep the pods outside of prime melta range.

    b) Draw fire from the Guardsmen, and hopefully tempt the Guard player into a couple of friendly-fire incidents.

    c) MAYBE have the drop pod generate cover saves for the units behind – depends on just how dense the Guard infantry screen is.


    2) A Raider or two to stand off and:

    a) Help keep the Terminators safe from Medusa/Demolisher blasts, along with any incidental sniping.

    b) Trade shots with Guard anti-tank snipers whilst advancing (slowly) – I’d say that 2 twin-linked BS4 lascannon versus a single BS4 “ordnance” battlecannon is a pretty fair match. Subject to deployment and lines of sight, of course – 72” might be great on paper, but maximising your range advantage for a tank-mounted direct-fire weapon is tricky…


    Granted, its risky, but Guard armies have the volume of fire AND enough spare hulls to generate cover saves that I just can’t afford to zoom around the midfield trading shots.


    Incidentally, with regard to a Guard list, I’d actually go with Demolishers with plasma cannon sponsons and Hydras. Maybe a Medusa or two. Add Chimeras and about 70 (1 infantry platoon, 2 squads of Veterans) infantry models, with a scattering of autocannon and meltas.

    At 1750, I’m looking at 4 Chimeras, 1 squadron of 2 Hydras, 1 squadron of 2 plasma Demolishers, 1 squadron of 2 Medusas, 2 units of melta-toting Vets and 50 infantry (2 autocannon, 2 flamers, 1 power weapon and a Commissar.

 

 
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