Howling Banshees or Harlequins?

[Sainhann]

With only have three slots for Elites units and with Fire Dragons being a prime choice for at each one of there slots.

That leaves either one (you might want two units of Fire Dragons) or two slots leftover.

Which due to the lack of Close Combat abilites of Guardians, means either Striking Scorpions, Howling Banshees or Harlequins.

Oh I like Storm Guardians since they can get you some more Fusion Guns but we all know that their Close Combat Ability is only good against Imperial Guardsmen, Tau, or other Eldar Guardians.

How Striking Scorpions do have 3+ Armor but they cannot Fleet and while they have the better ability to wound Space Marines they do not take away the Marines armor save.

Howling Banshees can due to their Power Weapons but they need 5+ to wound so their are some issues there. But they can get Counter-Attack and with their high leadership will get that extra attack giving them usually 3 attacks each so will cause some pain.

Though their biggest issue is staying alive long enough so that they can get into Close Combat.

Actually you would want them to be on the receiving end of a charge. This way they get to do their Overwatch fire and then roll for their Counter-Attack. But this is not easy to get since smart players will just shoot them.

Which bring us to Harlequins, they cost the most but they are very deadly. But they do only have a 5+ save and you really need to make us of cover or upgrade to a Shadowseer which makes them even more costly.

My first army was a Harlequin army and there was a reason why GW nearly killed them off. When use right they were nearly unbeatable. I played many games with them (when I could talk a sucker into one) and I rarely lost.

They have changed since the mid-1990's but they can bring some major Close Combat capabilities to your army. But in order to do so you will not be bringing something else due to their high cost.

Plus getting them into Combat is also an issue. Since even with a Shadowseer if they are seen a Invul 5+ save is okay but they are still Eldar and some of them will die.

Which brings us to the main question.

For 6th Edition which unit is a better choice as your Close Combat unit?

For me I am going with Howling Banshees, the reasons are they do have Power Swords, the Exarch can buy the Triskele which gives her some nice shooting abilities with a AP 2 weapon. Plus they can Counter-Attack.

[Dalleron]

I would have to go with harlies for a couple reasons.

Better Staline. WS5 is pretty big. Init. 6. big, but not huge. Furious Charge. Yes please. Rending? Required in my eyes, for a possible increase in terminators.

In my eyes, they are a mix of banshee's and scorpions. Rending is rending, so they deal with infantry armour. 3 attacks base, more than a banshee, same as scorpions. Will be same strength as scorpions on the charge, with same attacks, but a higher weapon skill. so should equal more wounds in the end.
They should be able to take more damage than banshee's with a shadowseer with the rule change. Don't require counter attack as banshee's do, as you suggest.

Eldar as a general rule need to take advantage of cover. Which kinda sucks because it seems that ignore cover is making a comeback of sorts. It's all over the pyschic powers in the rulebook. And if noise marines get the USR, then it's another hit with the nerf bat for the Eldar.

But I offer this. Is it worth taking any CC units in an Eldar army? Having to be out of a vehicle the previous turn hurts the Eldar bad. If anyone sees Banshees hitting the ground, they are target A1++ gotta die. Even scorpions are in trouble with this. Have the Eldar gone back to being "Gundar"?

[Filthspew]

I have to agree with:

But I offer this. Is it worth taking any CC units in an Eldar army? Having to be out of a vehicle the previous turn hurts the Eldar bad. If anyone sees Banshees hitting the ground, they are target A1++ gotta die. Even scorpions are in trouble with this. Have the Eldar gone back to being "Gundar"?

Its just not worth it.

Mainly because Eldar has no dependable delivery of cc units.

Let Dire Avengers with Defend and huge numbers soak up the assaults.

If heavies are not filled with War Walkers then Wraithlords to punch the bejeesus out of them in counter assault.

If you want Eldar assault units as such, I only see Jetbikes working well in 6th.

Hide them in cover, counter assault when the enemy hits your line of Dire Avengers.

[Aramel]

Harlequins are great, but expensive. Personally I've use a seer council and that can work wonders used correctly. One decent tactic to try is having 10 scorpions with an Autarch outflank in a serpent (since all infiltrators can do this). With their decent save they should survive the trip to the enemy weakpoint and do some decent damage.

[Sainhann]

But I offer this. Is it worth taking any CC units in an Eldar army? Having to be out of a vehicle the previous turn hurts the Eldar bad. If anyone sees Banshees hitting the ground, they are target A1++ gotta die. Even scorpions are in trouble with this. Have the Eldar gone back to being "Gundar"?

I see Eldar CC units as a Counter Assault and not the good old go out and find something to kill.

They just cannot handle the shooting.

But place them behind some Guardians who you use to sucker your opponents CC unit to assault. You then charge in with your unit and deal out the damage.

Guardians are meant to die.

Oh and yes we should be running with not one but two CC units. Because many players are still living in the 5th Edition world of Close Combat will win you games.

I would agree that Harlequins are the best but just to freaking expensive. Normal point cost for a unit of ten would be 250 because you will need to take both the Kisses and Shadowseer.

For just 182 points I can get 10 Banshees which are just as good. Plus that would give me 68 points to spend on something else.

Plus I alway did prefer Footdar over Mech Eldar.

[SaganGree]

Harlequins are great, but expensive. Personally I've use a seer council and that can work wonders used correctly. One decent tactic to try is having 10 scorpions with an Autarch outflank in a serpent (since all infiltrators can do this). With their decent save they should survive the trip to the enemy weakpoint and do some decent damage.

Except the codex states specifically that an Autarch cannot join a unit of scorpions using the... rule that lets scorpions infiltrate and outflank.

[DarkLink]

Thanks to the transport rules, Banshees will probably be lucky to ever even see combat. Too slow and easy to shoot down. Harlequins can at least stay hidden until the last second.

[herigonz]

Let Dire Avengers with Defend and huge numbers soak up the assaults.

Bringing up Defend actually has me wondering about Bladestorm. I don't think I saw it mentioned in the FAQ. Lets say you actually shoot with your Dire Avengers using Bladestorm in your turn and get assaulted during your opponent's turn, does that mean you cannot Overwatch?

On the flip side, lets say you are advancing up and haven't shot your wad with your Dire Avengers and get charged, can you use Blade Storm to increase the Overwatch shots?

[Sainhann]

Bringing up Defend actually has me wondering about Bladestorm. I don't think I saw it mentioned in the FAQ. Lets say you actually shoot with your Dire Avengers using Bladestorm in your turn and get assaulted during your opponent's turn, does that mean you cannot Overwatch?

On the flip side, lets say you are advancing up and haven't shot your wad with your Dire Avengers and get charged, can you use Blade Storm to increase the Overwatch shots?

I think that in the first situation we will need a FAQ because as the way Bladestorm is written I would say no.

They use Bladestorm but then got jumped before they could reload. I wonder do they have a pistol?

For the second, yes if you have Bladestorm up then you can use it in Overwatch.

[Sainhann]

Thanks to the transport rules, Banshees will probably be lucky to ever even see combat. Too slow and easy to shoot down. Harlequins can at least stay hidden until the last second.

if you put any Eldar Elite unit out front of Guardians then yes expect them to die.

Guardians are there for a reason. They need to be in front of our Elites so that they can provide that cover save.